“We Want To Make It To The Knockouts at RWC 2025” – Sakura 15s Head Coach Lesley McKenzie

Lesley McKenzie is in the final months of preparing her Sakura 15s squad for the Rugby World Cup 2025, and we have consistently heard that the team is determined to win games in England. We caught up with the Japanese women’s Head Coach as she was in camp with the Squad in the Japanese Alps of Nagano, at the ski resort of Sugadaira. 

There Is A Arms Race To Compete At The Highest Level Of Women’s Rugby – Lesley McKenzie

2024 could be seen as a disappointing year, results-wise, for the Sakura 15. Across ten test matches, they recorded just three wins, with one draw and six losses. Two of the wins came in defending their Asia Rugby Women’s Championship title, but they also suffered a first loss to Fiji and could have beaten the USA in both matches, but let them slip.

2025 has seen them go three from three, and this time around, they beat the USA for the first time, and away from home, while defeating Kazakhstan and Hong Kong China to maintain their grip on the regional title.

So many of those losses last year were tight affairs; aside from maybe one defeat against Italy, they were very competitive in every fixture but were not as clinical or composed as they needed to be.

“The dynamics in the games that you’re referring to were frustrating for us as a program and frustrating for the girls, and it was really disappointing for them from a results perspective to finish the year as we did. At the same time, it probably reflects the growth that we have made and the distance that Japan has travelled as a team that has primarily competed within Asia.

We’ve built something where we now play test matches every year, and are given a test match calendar to compete globally and represent Asia this year at the Rugby World Cup, which is obviously a real honour for us and a responsibility to do that.”

Photo Credit- JRFU – Japan Salura 15 vs HKCR – AREWC 2025

Lesley McKenzie added, “Those close moments when they are experienced by teams regularly who play in regular test competition, like a Six Nations, there’s a lot of understanding of those moments where it turns and I think that’s where were still a little bit of immature program, and we are a very fresh program in the greater scheme of things. 

So you do get that frustration. You feel that anxiety in the girls as they want the results to reflect the progress they’ve made. So I think that was natural frustration. 

We’re playing teams that are used to playing in more competitions, but the South Africa and Fiji women are in a similar situation to us, where they aren’t in a regular competition that is test standard, and regularly competing against teams that are top three in the world. 

That’s where Wales, Ireland, Scotland, France, Italy, they always get their sort of quality check every year against teams like England and France.”

Photo Credit- World Rugby – Japan XV vs South Africa – WXV2 2024

On the pace of development in the women’s game, McKenzie explained. “The acceleration of the women’s game, especially towards this World Cup, since the one in New Zealand, since the advent of professionalism in a lot of the leading countries and contracting and the arms race that’s developed within the programs – the game is moving really fast. 

There’s not necessarily a sense of that within Japan, but you certainly see it reflected outside of Japan. You see it reflected in the programs, the performances, the staffing and the time together those teams now have. So we still have to scramble to stay in the pack and not fall behind, and it’s a real foot race. I think that needs to be acknowledged, because it reflects the progress we have made.”

WXV and Travel Experiences Have Been Vital

The lack of regular international competitions is the biggest complaint we hear from developing nations, and especially in Asia. It’s something both Asian rivals, Kazakhstan and Hong Kong China have said previously. The former did not play a test in 12 months between the ARWC, while HKCR competed in the WXV – there is no such competition in 2025.

Including the World Cup, Japan will probably hit ten test matches again in a calendar year, so how much has the addition of a global competition like WXV helped them in terms of getting to play different style opposition?

“As an accelerant to the growth of our program, it’s been immense. It’s been vital. The quality of the opposition is the quality we need to be playing and to have the certainty in the calendar of three weeks of different tests, that’s irreplaceable in terms of looking ahead to a World Cup preparation,” Lesley McKenzie told us.

Photo Credit – World Rugby – Japan XV – WXV2 2024

She went on to say, “Prior to that, and as a former Canadian International, I can certainly say that as well, Japan was a touring test team nation. We got what we could take. Maybe it’s two tests in Australia. Maybe it’s a game in Italy, a game in Scotland. We might have Ireland twice at home, but none of that prepares you for tournament play. None of that prepares you for the week-to-week, facing different teams, and for me as a coach, that was really new as an international coach. To coach in a tournament was so different from those one-off test matches. 

So knowing that we lacked that experience in New Zealand at the 2021 World Cup, and knowing that we’d been gifted that experience as preparation towards this one, I think it was vital for us. It was vital for some of those teams that we’re talking about. I mentioned before that Fiji, South Africa, Samoa, and Hong Kong China went to the WXV in Dubai. That’s what you need when you’re trying to set up a performance program that goes and builds year to year.”

We could not agree more, as it provides both contingency planning and strategic planning for the future. For a squad and management to be in each other’s company for a period of time together, and social aspects and that bonding, which, honestly, in a team sport like rugby, is hugely important.

“With COVID landing on the way to the World Cup in the last cycle, it gave everyone a new experience of bonding and a new appreciation for the the meaning of time spent together, first when you’re not together and when you want to be together, and then when you’re necessarily together, and you’re isolated together, and you’d rather be anywhere!

The team element of travel and the experience of going overseas, and even the challenges to communicate and connect in different languages, and with the host nation, and trying different food, we’ve benefited so much from the calendar that includes international regular travel, said Lesley McKenzie.

“We’ve got the Italy test coming up on the way to England for the World Cup. That’ll be our third test going through Italy, and that’s a nice sense of regularity for the players.

It used to be incredibly exotic for them when I started. When we went for the first time in 2019, nobody could get behind pasta. And now everyone’s fine. So some of those things just smooth out with the team, and being away and becoming fluent in travel. I think that’s maybe something the sevens teams will have experienced a lot more, but the fifteens just haven’t had that.”

Photo Credit: JRFU – The Sakura 15 played Italy in 2024 and face them again in 2025

Squad Development – Sakura 15

Lesley and her coaches are working with a much bigger group of players, and we get the impression they have access to more quality players than at the last Rugby World Cup. We have always been intrigued by the Japanese systems as they are unique – are the players really professional, semi-pro? With Japan, it’s always a bit of a question mark.

“One of the things I’ve really enjoyed about coaching in Japan and being here and seeing how it works is that there’s no sort of known script outside of Japan. It’s the intrigue of how the culture delivers rugby and why it’s so connected to rugby that has been really interesting. 

In terms of the player group, the competition domestically is not big. When I arrived, it was very driven by Sevens, and especially towards Tokyo 2020. It was such a Sevens focus in the women’s game, and the fifteens teams in the club system were largely, and still are probably 50ish per cent, composite teams of Sevens programs providing fifteens for a very limited season.

That presents difficulties in putting a player pool together, where you can build robustness and depth and the internal challenge to grow the game to the next level. It’s been a really deliberate focus on my part to drive an element of development, an element of talent identification, and make a lot of it as accessible as possible to continue pushing the boundaries out.

It was really a proud moment in May at the Asia Rugby Women’s Championship to be able to have a team on the field that was partially completed with club players who had had really strong club seasons, but then weren’t necessarily gonna be included in the wider training squad towards the World Cup. That doesn’t sound like much to your traditional rugby countries, but it’s a big deal for us. 

Photo Credit- JRFU -Japan Sakura 15 vs Kazakhstan – AREWC 2025

McKenzie continued, “That incremental growth has been a real focus for us. The setup in the sport delivery here is fascinating because it allows for really concentrated development within the clubs, as they have such good corporate support in Japan. And through corporate support, a lot of the clubs can contract overseas players, and they can provide their club players with jobs that will accommodate club training. That’s one of the real strengths of the women’s side of the program over here. 

There’s a lot of time that can be allocated to team training, whether it’s volleyball, whether it’s softball, whether it’s rugby, because the companies support players and clubs through employment.”

With that quasi semi-pro model, undoubtedly, players sacrifice a lot to wear the Sakura badge. But that struggle to compete at the top level in the women’s game and have the resources to fund it is not limited to Japan.

“I just point to my experience overseas at national teams who historically have been under-resourced on the women’s side, they certainly have to work just as hard to find opportunities to play. The Canadian and the US teams at the moment, and to an extent, some of the South African girls who have travelled to the UK to play the the scarcity of high-level women’s 15 competitions is still limiting for countries that are outside of that scope of the PWR and the French league. You have the Celtic Challenge getting underway, and sort of Super W and Apiki starting to fill some space

As far as high-performance environments, the girls don’t have access to that in the shape of a rigorous club competition, but they have really good support within their clubs. The girls work tremendously hard. 

Quite a few of the Japanese players have also played in the UK, Australia, New Zealand and in France over the past couple of seasons – far more than their male counterparts. Is that something she would be encouraged to do?

“I’m absolutely all for that, and we’d be the first to say you can’t spend your life in rugby without considering those overseas and different cultures, different club environments, etc, can change you. So yes, we encourage it, and I am absolutely for it.”

Remaining Tests Before RWC 2025 – Spain and Italy

Photo Credit – Japan Sakura 15 in RWC 2025 training camp

They have three test matches before the opening game of the Rugby World Cup against Ireland on Sunday, 24 August 2025 at Franklin’s Gardens in Northampton. Two fixtures against Spain and one against Italy. Would they have liked more games to prepare?

“Everyone wants more. Everyone wishes they had more. I think, like you said, the Spain games will be good, because there’ll be a great psychological test for both of us. Italy is a team that plays rugby that is really dynamic, and they have put together some really good rugby towards the back end of the Six Nations. 

We get a chance to play at home, in front of home crowds, and that’s pretty good. You could always ask for more, but we’re pretty happy with what we have.”

Japan Sakura 15s Taiyo Life JAPAN RUGBY CHALLENGE SERIES 2025 vs Spain

• Japan vs Spain – July 19 2025 (Saturday) – 18:00 KO* – Mikuni World Stadium Kitakyushu (Fukuoka)  
• Japan vs Spain – July 26 2025 (Saturday) – 17:05 KO – Chichibunomiya Rugby Stadium (Tokyo)
• Italy vs Japan – August 9 2025 (Saturday) – 19:30 KO – Stadio San Michele (Calvisano, Italy)

*Local KO times shown

Photo Credit – World Rugby

Rugby World Cup 2025 – “The Level Of Rugby Is Going To Be Better Than Anyone’s Ever Seen” – Lesley McKenzie

McKenzie told us, “In this camp, we had three former Japanese women’s representatives come in, who were all at the 1994 World Cup. They talked to the girls about buying their own tape, strapping each other, paying their own way to get over there – all of those things. You could just see minds melting because it’s so different. 

I think that’s really important – they didn’t even have the right to wear the sakura on their jerseys. They had to buy their own badges and sew those on. We’re still within a generation of night and day, as far as that goes, it’s hard to take things for granted when you hear things like that.

I do think the level of rugby is going to be better than anyone’s ever seen before – That’s almost the guarantee of this tournament. People have seen what’s achievable when they put some resources into their women’s programs, and they are really going for it.”

She added, “You almost don’t want to miss the jump, because if you do, then you’re out in the cold a little bit. We both know how that feels when nations are trying to get somewhere, and you just can’t get in the door. It’s gonna be exceptional rugby in terms of where the women’s game has gone from when I started playing at university in 1998.

I cannot believe the change in the availability and the professionalism, what the game looks like, and what access players and management have to real performance environments now. It’s staggering what the difference is in just those couple of decades.”

Rugby World Cup 2025 Fixtures

• Japan vs Ireland –  Sunday, 24 August 2025 @Franklin’s Gardens, Northampton
• Japan vs New Zealand –  Sunday 31 August 2025 @Sandy Park, Exeter
• Japan vs Spain – Sunday 7th September 2025 @York Community Stadium, York

Photo Credit – JRFU – Japan Sakura 15 and Lesley McKenzie in RWC 2025 training camp

The 2025 RWC will have a real impact, and we have seen that already. How will it have a knock-on effect in Japan for women’s rugby, and how can Japanese women’s rugby take the next step?

“This is the whole point. The point of our team is not about one team realising something in one year. It’s about how you build some legacy and not only build on the foundation, but increase it, solidify it, make it more accessible for those that you inspire to come after.

One really cool output from the talk that we had the ladies come and give, is that all three of them contribute to youth rugby in some way, whether it’s teaching little ones, teaching youth groups, and one of them is employed by the union and she has a huge hand in growing the game at all levels for the women. They spoke about their continuing involvement in the women’s game and trying to grow that. 

One of our players asked, ‘What can the Sakura 15 players do for you? How can we support what you’re doing to grow the game?’ And the answer was: ‘Perform. Your job now is to perform at the World Cup and be those role models.’

It’s one of those moments that you know hits the players hard. It hits me hard. If we can create some of those highlights on that type of stage, and we can be that level of inspiration for the girls that want to play here, and the people that see how well the girls play and what they can do. That’s crucial in Japan; it’s crucial to get the foothold, and it’s crucial to keep moving, because the game keeps moving everywhere else. We have to probably accept our role is to build and to create something that’s a foothold for the next level, because there has to be a next level, and what will that look like?”

The Japanese are in another tough pool with New Zealand, Ireland and Spain. The Spanish are in Japan for two tests in July, which will provide a good litmus test in terms of where they’re at. When we have spoken with some of the players who played in NZ at the last World Cup, there was disappointment that they didn’t manage to get a win, but they were knocking on the door. What are the goals Lesley and the team collectively have set for this World Cup?

“At the last Rugby World Cup, I think arguably ours was the toughest pool out there. There was no team in that pool that you could almost sort of see yourself matching against when you considered the number of test caps we had and the number of international overseas tours that we didn’t have – so the frustration and disappointment in the player group was the frustration and disappointment of a very young player group.

Photo Credit -JRFU – Japan Sakura XV vs USA 2025 – they achieved their first win over the USA to kickstart their test season

We were the youngest team of that World Cup, and those were the reflections of a young playing group that maybe didn’t appreciate how intensive the competition is elsewhere, how developed the competition of club teams and the history is elsewhere. It was a bit of a naive, but understandable disappointment. I think this group has had so much more exposure and had a lot more grounding, a lot more education, a lot more experience.

We are not going to England just to get a win, but we’re very clear that we want to make it to the knockouts, we want to go to a quarter-final. We think we’ve got a chance of going to a quarter final if we get our preparation right, and if we put in the performances on the field –  that doesn’t feel like a bridge too far.”

Japan Sakura 15 News

• Details For Japan Sakura 15s Taiyo Life JAPAN RUGBY CHALLENGE SERIES 2025 Against Spain Confirmed.
• Japan Sakura Fifteens and Brave Blossoms 2025 Domestic Fixtures Announced.
• Women’s Rugby World Cup England 2025 Pools Confirmed – Japan in Pool C.
• Sakura Fifteen Confirm Italy Fixture Ahead of RWC 2025.